Ashkenazi, Sephardi, Mizrachi Jewish Research

[Elizabeth Catherine Herbert]

I know that I am of Jewish and also of royal descent. My matriarchal grandmother's line is royal.

Ladislaus I of Hungary is your 27th great grandfather.
You
→ Mary Sue Anderson (adopted) Stout
your mother → Charles Carl Anderson
her adoptive father → Nancy Anderson (Counts) (Her adoptive father is her 4th cousin of the same family origins of Royal and Jewish descent)
his mother → Mahalia Grizzle "Ailey" (Amburgey) Counts
her mother → Aily Amburgey
her mother → Elizabeth Grizzle (Hammond)
her mother → Mary Elizabeth Hammon (Markham)
her mother → Princess Praskovia Mikhailovna Markham, Princess Kurakina
her mother → duchess Mavra Dmitrievna Kurakina
her mother → Prince Dmitri Alexeijevich Galitzine
her father → Prince Aleksej Andrejevich Golitsyn
his father → Andrey Andreyevich Golitsyn
his father → Anna Ivanovna Golitsyna
his mother → Prince Ivan Bielski of Moscow
her father → prince Dymitr Bielski of Moscow
his father → prince Fiodor Bielski
his father → princess Vasilisa Olshanska
his mother → prince Andrey Drutski
her father → princess Agrippina of Smolensk
his mother → Alexandra of Tver'
her mother → Anastasia, princess of Halych
her mother → King Yuri I of Galicia, King of Ruthenia, Great Prince of Kiev, Volydymyr-Volhynia, Haly
her father → Constance of Hungary
his mother → Maria Lascarina
her mother → Theodoros I, Emperor of Nicaea
her father → Manuel Laskaris
his father → Maria Komnene
his mother → Saint Irene of Hungary
her mother → Ladislaus I of Hungary
her father

I decided to compare to the kit. I am lizacpi. It's a screen name. I was born Elisabet Danielle DeSalvo Hernly Ichiju, or Elizabeth Hernly for short.

Comparing Kit GC8368617 (*lizacpi) [23andMe] and Kit KJ9269628 (*Ladislaus I of Hungary) [23andMe]

Here are my results using 100 window size and 7 cm segment size.

Largest segment = 7.2 cM

Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 7.2cM (0.2 Pct)
Estimated number of generations to MRCA = 7.5

1 shared segments found for this comparison.

482326 SNPs used for this comparison.

69.136 Pct SNPs are full identical

Comparison took 0.168.
CPU time used: 0.029.

Ver: Jan 16 2023 04 42 34

[Celia (2)]

Buenos dias amigos, Central Mexican (Jalisco) here! I have very cool DNA, my grandma has Algerian/French and my grandfather is still a bit of a mystery to me since he passed away before he could get his DNA test, but using my cousin as a proxy I could make an educated guess and say he was a Greek (Eastern Sephardic) from Salonika, I am also including my mom as well because she is the reason I began doing research into our background. Take note, I have no idea where the romanian comes from, I don't know everything sadly.

Without further ado; I'll start with my grandma out of respect since she's the eldest (g-d rest her soul), then go down the intergenerational ladder until we get to me. All MDLP World 4-population Results. If you have any questions please ask, I hope to also meet the legendary and much more educated Kevin Brooke by posting this!!

My grandmother:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Mexican @ 6.857132
2 Serrano @ 11.835792
3 Miwok @ 11.938758
4 Cochimi @ 15.873375
5 Tsimsian @ 21.571058
6 Costanoan @ 23.517120
7 Kumiai @ 26.676788
8 Haida @ 27.405781
9 Puerto-Rican @ 27.600298
10 Colombian @ 29.058292
11 Cucupa @ 32.773182
12 Ashkenazim @ 33.049297
13 Colville @ 34.718258
14 Ashkenazim_V @ 36.431503
15 Jew_Romania @ 36.783749
16 Tatar_Crim @ 37.243752
17 Greek_South @ 37.784817
18 Apache @ 38.053364
19 Greek_North @ 38.187988
20 Aleut @ 38.567623

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Mexican +50% Mexican @ 6.857132

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Cucupa +25% Lumbee +25% Jew_Morocco @ 3.775702


Using 4 populations approximation:
+++++
1 Pima + Cochimi + Basque + Yemen @ 3.484758
2 Mixtec + Cochimi + Basque + Yemen @ 3.548353
3 Huichol + Cochimi + Basque + Yemen @ 3.562438
4 Jordanian + Colombian + Basque + Navajo @ 3.592060
5 Apache + Jew_Morocco + Colombian + Puerto-Rican @ 3.674629
6 Apache + Jew_Algeria + Colombian + Puerto-Rican @ 3.681167
7 Cucupa + Cucupa + Lumbee + Jew_Morocco @ 3.775702
8 Luiseno + Cochimi + Ashkenazim + Puerto-Rican @ 3.790734
9 Luiseno + Cochimi + Jew_France + Puerto-Rican @ 3.793356
10 Jew_France + Colombian + Puerto-Rican + Navajo @ 3.804221
11 Karitiana + Haida + Mozabite + Kosovar @ 3.849200
12 Luiseno + Cochimi + Jew_Italia + Puerto-Rican @ 3.883568
13 Luiseno + Cochimi + Jew_Algeria + Puerto-Rican @ 3.884620
14 Apache + Colombian + Basque + Yemen @ 3.900949
15 Pima + Cochimi + Romania + Mozabite @ 3.902403
16 Maya + Kumiai + Basque + Yemen @ 3.912976
17 Maya + Cochimi + Jew_Algeria + Puerto-Rican @ 3.920784
18 Luiseno + Cochimi + Jew_Morocco + Puerto-Rican @ 3.922987
19 Apache + Sephardim + Colombian + Puerto-Rican @ 3.924844
20 Apache + Jew_Tunisia + Colombian + Puerto-Rican @ 3.930375

My mom:
Least-squares method.
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Mexican @ 4.684947
2 Miwok @ 9.353386
3 Serrano @ 9.756748
4 Cochimi @ 13.813648
5 Tsimsian @ 18.919109
6 Kumiai @ 24.879934
7 Haida @ 25.464870
8 Costanoan @ 26.379860
9 Colombian @ 27.669533
10 Puerto-Rican @ 27.679651
11 Cucupa @ 31.605009
12 Colville @ 35.030567
13 Ashkenazim @ 35.756805
14 Apache @ 36.442448
15 Aleut @ 36.860588
16 Ashkenazim_V @ 37.816017
17 Jew_Romania @ 38.870346
18 Tatar_Crim @ 39.147095
19 Tlingit @ 39.166153
20 Greek_South @ 39.213612

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Cucupa +50% Puerto-Rican @ 4.244455


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Serrano +25% Serrano +25% Puerto-Rican @ 3.024250


Using 4 populations approximation:
+++++
1 Luiseno + Serrano + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 2.413660
2 Serrano + Serrano + Serrano + Puerto-Rican @ 3.024250
3 Luiseno + Cochimi + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.079351
4 Cochimi + Serrano + Serrano + Puerto-Rican @ 3.262698
5 Cucupa + Kumiai + Lumbee + Ashkenazim @ 3.336706
6 Maya + Serrano + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.364443
7 Pima + Serrano + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.418215
8 Maya + Kumiai + Lumbee + Ashkenazim @ 3.426399
9 Maya + Kumiai + Lumbee + Jew_France @ 3.437010
10 Mixtec + Serrano + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.438742
11 Maya + Kumiai + Lumbee + Sicilian @ 3.486912
12 Serrano + Mexican + Mexican + Mexican @ 3.492651
13 Huichol + Serrano + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.501571
14 Cucupa + Cucupa + Lumbee + Ashkenazim @ 3.650613
15 Luiseno + Cucupa + Lumbee + Corsican @ 3.659758
16 Kumiai + Serrano + Mexican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.666949
17 Huichol + Mexican + Puerto-Rican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.698390
18 Maya + Kumiai + Lumbee + Jew_Italia @ 3.723387
19 Cucupa + Mexican + Mexican + Puerto-Rican @ 3.724174
20 Kumiai + Kumiai + Lumbee + Costanoan @ 3.753323

My Cousin:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Mexican @ 9.030188
2 Serrano @ 9.696523
3 Miwok @ 11.608579
4 Cochimi @ 15.735274
5 Tsimsian @ 18.663570
6 Costanoan @ 23.583586
7 Haida @ 24.486530
8 Kumiai @ 25.907339
9 Colombian @ 28.870783
10 Puerto-Rican @ 29.751854
11 Cucupa @ 32.077827
12 Ashkenazim @ 34.661606
13 Aleut @ 34.964256
14 Colville @ 34.969196
15 Apache @ 36.006168
16 Tatar_Crim @ 36.522865
17 Ashkenazim_V @ 36.605053
18 Jew_Romania @ 37.408981
19 Tlingit @ 38.051685
20 Greek_South @ 38.291527

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Apache +50% Ashkenazim_V @ 5.801103


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Cucupa +25% Swedish +25% Jordanian @ 3.204807


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++
1 Jordanian + Colombian + Orcadian + Navajo @ 2.574794
2 Jordanian + Colombian + British + Navajo @ 2.721413
3 Jordanian + Welsh + Colombian + Navajo @ 2.746305
4 Luiseno + Kumiai + Jordanian + Orcadian @ 2.753713
5 Cucupa + Apache + Jordanian + CEU @ 2.783074
6 Cucupa + Apache + Jordanian + Orcadian @ 2.783636
7 Jordanian + CEU + Colombian + Navajo @ 2.813159
8 Cucupa + Apache + Jordanian + British @ 2.823223
9 Cucupa + Apache + Jordanian + Welsh @ 2.836737
10 Luiseno + Kumiai + Jordanian + British @ 2.849933
11 Luiseno + Kumiai + Jordanian + CEU @ 2.904020
12 Luiseno + Kumiai + Jordanian + Welsh @ 2.907071
13 Karitiana + Haida + Jordanian + British @ 2.963612
14 Karitiana + Haida + Jordanian + Orcadian @ 2.996584
15 Huichol + Cochimi + Jordanian + Orcadian @ 3.007742
16 Huichol + Cochimi + Jordanian + CEU @ 3.008009
17 Pima + Cochimi + Jordanian + CEU @ 3.012603
18 Karitiana + Haida + Jordanian + CEU @ 3.026907
19 Huichol + Cochimi + Jordanian + Welsh @ 3.030937
20 Pima + Cochimi + Jordanian + Orcadian @ 3.033151

Me:
Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Mexican @ 7.942030
2 Miwok @ 10.256547
3 Serrano @ 11.822747
4 Cochimi @ 17.064211
5 Tsimsian @ 20.787020
6 Costanoan @ 21.883472
7 Puerto-Rican @ 26.951206
8 Kumiai @ 27.830454
9 Haida @ 28.044870
10 Colombian @ 29.765190
11 Ashkenazim @ 32.273403
12 Cucupa @ 33.936413
13 Colville @ 34.482605
14 Tatar_Crim @ 34.655083
15 Ashkenazim_V @ 34.829475
16 Jew_Romania @ 35.313629
17 Greek_South @ 36.002407
18 Greek_North @ 36.283951
19 Greek_Center @ 36.977772
20 Aleut @ 37.109852

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Cochimi +50% Costanoan @ 5.490526


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Cucupa +25% Lumbee +25% Greek_Cretan @ 2.889173


Using 4 populations approximation:
+++++++
1 Luiseno + Miwok + Costanoan + Puerto-Rican @ 2.780292
2 Serrano + Costanoan + Colombian + Puerto-Rican @ 2.837321
3 Maya + Miwok + Costanoan + Puerto-Rican @ 2.868863
4 Cucupa + Cucupa + Lumbee + Greek_Cretan @ 2.889173
5 Karitiana + Tsimsian + Lumbee + Jew_Tunisia @ 2.912034
6 Mixtec + Serrano + Lumbee + Jew_France @ 2.914281
7 Cypriot + Cucupa + Kumiai + Lumbee @ 2.931630
8 Cypriot + Maya + Cochimi + Lumbee @ 2.946398
9 Maya + Serrano + Greek_Azov + Puerto-Rican @ 2.957733
10 Cypriot + Apache + Lumbee + Colombian @ 2.962722
11 Mixtec + Serrano + Lumbee + Jew_Italia @ 2.973568
12 Pima + Serrano + Lumbee + Jew_France @ 2.986674
13 Luiseno + Serrano + Jew_Romania + Puerto-Rican @ 2.987628
14 Huichol + Mexican + Greek_Azov + Puerto-Rican @ 3.002977
15 Mixtec + Mexican + Greek_Azov + Puerto-Rican @ 3.009905
16 Mixtec + Serrano + Lumbee + Sephardim @ 3.010426
17 Huichol + Serrano + Lumbee + Jew_France @ 3.011868
18 Cucupa + Kumiai + Jew_Syria + Lumbee @ 3.016318
19 Pima + Serrano + Lumbee + Jew_Italia @ 3.029719
20 Apache + Lumbee + Sephardim + Colombian @ 3.059023

We got the result of a fullmito analysis, a group t2e1b with a private mutation, which has another user, also of Jewish origin.

Right on! My grandma has t2c1b which is right next to yours. She's had a lot of matches in her One-To-Many comparison tool that have Romanian/Portugese in them, with recent puerto rican. Say, would anyone here know about puerto rican jews going to Mexico?

Back to my grandfathers side.
I know Greeks (and east sephardim) being settled in Mexico during the late 1800's and early 1900's.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_Mexicans
A few of those newly brought immigrants were also mixed with Italian/sicilian jewry, and of course within those new arrivals, the Jews who first settled in salonika from Alexandria, Egypt, back in 140 BC. It's fascinating, my cousin has more of my grandfathers direct lineage, showing a very high egyptian and jordanian distance in his PuntDNAL results with Greek_Thessaly, if anyone would like to see them I would be honored in posting them. It wasn't until recently that I learned how much "lost" history there was behind us and how much there was to discover.
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/salonika

What I'd like to do now is learn how to compare SNP data from each chromosome directly and find people in the gedmatch One-To-Many tool with that same Greeco-Italian Jewish heritage.

[Kevin Brook]

Leo Cooper found that the mtDNA haplogroup T2c1b occurs among Tunisian Jews, Algerian Jews, and Moroccan Jews - among other populations.

Sephardic ancestry is quite common among Mexicans with heritage from colonial families of Jalisco.
On the other hand, most ethnic Greeks don't have traces of Sephardic ancestry.

[Celia (2)]

Leo Cooper found that the mtDNA haplogroup T2c1b occurs among Tunisian Jews, Algerian Jews, and Moroccan Jews - among other populations.

Thanks for that information, I appreciate it Kevin. My search on her side has, for the most part, concluded. I found of there being french immigration to Mexico during the second french intervention of Mexico, which would explain her DNA, whether French troops decided to stay or intermingled with the locals I can't say for certain, but a lot of Basque/French from her may come from that era.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_ ... _in_Mexico
French influx included the Algerian Jewish diaspora, since the French conquest of Algeria went on during that time, possibly explaining her heritage. I just hope we aren't related to "Carlota La Loca", grandma always did say we had blue blood, but not like this! Ah, we were always quite lugubrious.

Sephardic ancestry is quite common among Mexicans with heritage from colonial families of Jalisco.
On the other hand, most ethnic Greeks don't have traces of Sephardic ancestry.

That's interesting, and crucial information because there's a lot of eastern mediterrenean in our grandfathers side of the family, I think we might be bulgarian greek, otherwise known in the modern world as (North) Macedonian, there's a lot of pontic greek here, and jordanian from egypt.

The results of my cousins World 22 tests brings up more Ashkenazi (and strangely enough, more Jordanian) results than it does Sephardic, especially in Eurogenes, where Sephardic is further than Ashkenazi. It must be from the historical Macedonian side from years of their activity in egypt, there's pontic greek in there as well which makes sense as there was trade before the destruction of Smyrna in 1922.
Smyrna and Phocaea show up in some tests as well as Thessaly, I will update the reason why once I find out more about my grandfathers history.

His Y-DNA haplogroup is R-CTS4065 if that helps. I hear 23andme isn't very good when it comes to the Y haplogroup though, and his may actually be different.

The Jordanian might just be pre-Ashkenazim/Egyptian Jews from much longer ago (140 B.C) and not 1492 sephardic exiles like I once thought. It's still up in the air for me, but the Tunisian Jewish, Libyan Jewish, and of course Jordanian from my grandfather makes me think of families brought in from egypt to greece long ago and mixed with Romaniotes somewhere in Sofia, just a guess of course.
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/sofia
https://sephardicgenealogy.com/regions/ ... -salonica/

MDLP K16 Modern 4-Ancestors Oracle
Admix Results (sorted):
# Population Percent
1 Amerindian 36.91
2 Caucasian 17.13
3 Neolithic 15.68
4 NorthEastEuropean 8.30
5 Steppe 7.06
6 NearEast 4.75
7 Subsaharian 4.35
8 SouthEastAsian 2.00
9 Arctic 1.81
10 NorthAfrican 1.47


Finished reading population data. 517 populations found.
16 components mode.
--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Athabask_NA @ 30.109093
2 Tlingit_NA @ 33.929165
3 Jew_Ashkenazi @ 39.772655
4 Lipka_Tatar_Belorus @ 41.400738
5 Swiss_Switzerland @ 41.403595
6 Tatars_Tatarstan @ 41.789364
7 Italian_Friul @ 41.845757
8 Jew_Belmonte @ 41.867065
9 Romanian_Romania @ 41.899063
10 Italian_NorthIitaly @ 41.928257
11 Gagauz_Gagauzia @ 42.075340
12 Portuguese_Portugal @ 42.230522
13 Austrian_Austria @ 42.293858
14 Moldavian_Molodva @ 42.511593
15 Romanian_Apuseni @ 42.593075
16 Corsican_Corsica @ 42.649445
17 Romanian_Gorj @ 42.679958
18 Kryashen_Bashkortostan @ 42.775322
19 Provencal_Provence @ 42.831196
20 Montenegrian_Montenegro @ 42.897949

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Bolivian_Pando +50% Italian_NorthIitaly @ 7.941510


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Jew_Ashkenazi +25% Athabask_NA +25% Bolivian_Cochabamba @ 6.264335


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++
1 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Mayan_NA @ 5.280972
2 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Quechua_NA @ 5.301012
3 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Mixtec_NA @ 5.306302
4 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Zapotec_NA @ 5.324072
5 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Zapotec_NA @ 5.324072
6 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Corsican_Corsica + Mayan_NA @ 5.337897
7 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Corsican_Corsica + Mixtec_NA @ 5.347368
8 Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Karitiana_NA + Sicilian_Sicily @ 5.348255
9 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Corsican_Corsica + Zapotec_NA @ 5.349771
10 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Corsican_Corsica + Zapotec_NA @ 5.349771
11 Jew_Algeria + Athabask_NA + Italian_Friul + Mixtec_NA @ 5.356309
12 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Bolivian_Cochabamba + Italian_NorthIitaly @ 5.356510
13 Jew_Algeria + Athabask_NA + Italian_Friul + Karitiana_NA @ 5.377613
14 Jew_Algeria + Athabask_NA + Italian_Friul + Zapotec_NA @ 5.378925
15 Jew_Algeria + Athabask_NA + Italian_Friul + Zapotec_NA @ 5.378925
16 Jew_Ashkenazim + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Karitiana_NA @ 5.397745
17 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Corsican_Corsica + Quechua_NA @ 5.401704
18 Jew_Algeria + Athabask_NA + Italian_Friul + Surui_NA @ 5.403982
19 Jew_Ashkenazi + Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Karitiana_NA @ 5.412864
20 Athabask_NA + Italian_NorthIitaly + Sicilian_Sicily + Surui_NA @ 5.413564
In context of Friul, I found this. It might be something, considering this is in North Italy as well, there's been a Jewish presence as well.
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/aquileia


There's this, which shows distance to Phocaea, do you know about any Romaniotes having Pontic Greek?

MDLP K23b Oracle
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Amerindian 37.43
2 Caucasian 16.91
3 European_Early_Farmers 15.52
4 European_Hunters_Gatherers 9.73
5 Near_East 5.42
6 Subsaharian 4.13
7 North_African 3.21
8 African_Pygmy 2.66
9 Paleo_Siberian 1.95
10 Ancestral_Altaic 1.42

Finished reading population data. 620 populations found.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Mexican_CV_ @ 8.122571
2 Mexican_ @ 10.371200
3 Miwok_ @ 12.998441
4 Serrano_ @ 15.047958
5 Ojibwa_ @ 21.075087
6 Tsimsian_ @ 22.769325
7 Colombian_ @ 24.469278
8 Cree_ @ 26.364361
9 Algonquin_ @ 26.433571
10 Haida_ @ 27.327209
11 Puerto_Rican_ @ 28.531300
12 Cochimi_ @ 31.656990
13 Chilote_ @ 31.764088
14 Kumiai_ @ 34.950081
15 Cucupa_ @ 41.579002
16 Sicilian_West_ @ 43.611290
17 Maltese_ @ 43.724854
18 Ashkenazi_Jew_ @ 43.772305
19 Sicilian_Trapani_ @ 44.053223
20 Turk_Balikesir_ @ 44.236267

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Cucupa_ +50% Sicilian_Trapani_ @ 7.381931

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Kumiai_ +25% Puerto_Rican_ +25% Romanian_Jew_ @ 4.762350

Using 4 populations approximation:
+++++
1 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Quechua_Bolivia_ @ 4.156707
2 Greek_Phokaia_ + Huichol_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.156790
3 Greek_Phokaia_ + Kaqchikel_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.157916
4 Cabecar_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.159042
5 Chane_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.159042
6 Greek_Phokaia_ + Guarani_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.159042
7 Greek_Phokaia_ + Karitiana_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.159042
8 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Mixe_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.159042
9 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Surui_ @ 4.159042
10 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Wayuu_ @ 4.159042
11 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Ticuna_ @ 4.160170
12 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Wichi_ @ 4.160170
13 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Zapotec_ @ 4.224930
14 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Zapotec_ @ 4.236481
15 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_ + Puerto_Rican_ + Totonac_ @ 4.256541
16 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_ + Piapoco_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.266292
17 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_ + Mixtec_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.267999
18 Cachi_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.273447
19 Aymara_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.279579
20 Greek_Phokaia_ + Mexican_CV_ + Piapoco_ + Puerto_Rican_ @ 4.280752

I know about ancient Egyptian mummies having DNA from Jordan and Israel, so this is what the ancient dna of macedonian/salonica jews had, and possibly my grandfather. I'm speculating on our end of course, even if I do sound certain, but there was interaction with the Egyptians.
https://www.nature.com/articles/546017a

I could call it Bulgarian Romaniote and be satisfied with it, but "Greek_Azov" seems to be near Ukraine, which isn't pontic greek but it's still a unique genetic marker, especially paired with the Jordanian, there are so many possible interactions here.

MDLP WORLD-22
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Mesoamerican 20.88
2 Atlantic_Mediterranean_Neolithic 18.48
3 North-Amerind 14.46
4 North-East-European 13.59
5 West-Asian 9.46
6 Near_East 8.30
7 South-America_Amerind 4.80
8 Sub-Saharian 4.39
9 North-European-Mesolithic 1.93
10 Arctic-Amerind 1.48
11 Pygmy 1.19

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Miwok_derived @ 10.888516
2 Mexican_derived @ 11.126184
3 Serrano_derived @ 13.628510
4 Cochimi_derived @ 17.305334
5 Costanoan_derived @ 22.687164
6 Kumiai_derived @ 26.669239
7 Tsimsian_derived @ 27.170092
8 Puerto-Rican_derived @ 27.909979
9 Colombian_derived @ 28.558868
10 Ashkenazim_derived @ 33.038284
11 Haida_derived @ 33.196419
12 Tatar_Crim_derived @ 34.421722
13 Ashkenazim_V_derived @ 34.569016
14 Colville_derived @ 34.640144
15 Cucupa_derived @ 34.983753
16 Jew_Romania_derived @ 35.151684
17 Greek_South_derived @ 35.637554
18 Ste7_derived @ 35.824535
19 Greek_North_derived @ 36.130882
20 Greek_Center_derived @ 36.749317

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazim_V_derived +50% Maya_derived @ 6.257258


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Kumiai_derived +25% Lebanese_derived +25% Lumbee_derived @ 5.439598


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++
1 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Greek_Azov_derived + Puerto-Rican_derived @ 3.712963
2 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + German-South_derived + Jordanian_derived @ 3.886789
3 Apache_derived + CEU_derived + Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived @ 3.900662
4 Apache_derived + British_derived + Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived @ 3.987049
5 CEU_derived + Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived @ 4.143591
6 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + French_derived + Jordanian_derived @ 4.186130
7 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived + Orcadian_derived @ 4.197754
8 British_derived + Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived @ 4.228524
9 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Puerto-Rican_derived + Tatar_Crim_derived @ 4.294869
10 Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived + Miwok_derived + Tsimsian_derived @ 4.304220
11 Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived + Welsh_derived @ 4.341917
12 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived + Norwegian_V_derived @ 4.397203
13 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Jew_Syria_derived + Lumbee_derived @ 4.400774
14 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived + Swiss_derived @ 4.412340
15 Apache_derived + Colombian_derived + Jordanian_derived + Welsh_derived @ 4.414202
16 Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived + Norwegian_V_derived @ 4.428900
17 Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived + Orcadian_derived @ 4.432547
18 German_V_derived + Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived @ 4.446219
19 CEU_V_derived + Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived @ 4.457632
20 German-South_derived + Jordanian_derived + Kumiai_derived + Maya_derived @ 4.469992



PuntDNAL K13 Mixed Mode Oracle
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Americas 34.93
2 SW_Europe 24.92
3 NE_Europe 13.68
4 SW_Asia 7.31
5 West_Asia 6.31
6 Siberia 4.53
7 West_Africa 4.08
8 East_Africa 2.39
9 NE_Asia 1.28
10 South_Africa 0.48
11 SE_Asia 0.08

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Mexican 8.04
2 Colombian 15.15
3 Ecuadorian 18.31
4 Puerto_Rican 28.46
5 Aluet 43.29
6 Albanian 44.97
7 Greek_Thessaly 45.16
8 Greek_Central 45.24
9 Italian_Abruzzo 45.37
10 Italian_Sicilian 45.43
11 Ashkenazy_Jew 45.49
12 Italian_Tuscan 45.55
13 Kosovar 45.56
14 Tunisian 45.68
15 Dominican 45.76
16 Turkish_Aydin 45.85
17 Bulgarian 45.88
18 Macedonian 46.02
19 Romanian 46.04
20 Nogay 46.27

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 88.2% Mexican + 11.8% Egyptian_Copts @ 3.87
2 86.8% Mexican + 13.2% Sephardic_Jew @ 3.89
3 86.7% Mexican + 13.3% Ashkenazy_Jew @ 4.02
4 86.7% Mexican + 13.3% Italian_Sicilian @ 4.05
5 86.7% Mexican + 13.3% Italian_Abruzzo @ 4.06
6 86.7% Mexican + 13.3% Greek_Central @ 4.07
7 87.8% Mexican + 12.2% Egyptian @ 4.11
8 87.8% Mexican + 12.2% Jordanian @ 4.13
9 86.9% Mexican + 13.1% Turkish_Aydin @ 4.15
10 88.1% Mexican + 11.9% Palestinian @ 4.17
11 86.7% Mexican + 13.3% Albanian @ 4.18
12 86.9% Mexican + 13.1% Tunisian @ 4.18
13 86.8% Mexican + 13.2% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.22
14 86.9% Mexican + 13.1% Kosovar @ 4.25
15 86.9% Mexican + 13.1% Italian_Tuscan @ 4.28
16 87.3% Mexican + 12.7% Turkish @ 4.31
17 87.1% Mexican + 12.9% Macedonian @ 4.34
18 88% Mexican + 12% Syrian @ 4.36
19 87.1% Mexican + 12.9% Romanian @ 4.36
20 87.3% Mexican + 12.7% Algerian @ 4.36




puntDNAL K15 Oracle
Admix Results (sorted):

#PopulationPercent
1Amerindian32.49
2Mediterranean20.43
3NE_European18.84
4Caucasian6.86
5SW_Asian5.55
6W_African4.58
7Beringian4.49
8Horn_Of_Africa2.46
9Siberian1.96
10S_Indian1.08
11Omo_River1.03

Finished reading population data. 157 populations found.
15 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Mexican @ 11.124408
2 Colombian_B @ 12.103208
3 Ecuadorian @ 22.387690
4 Puerto_Rican @ 27.565777
5 Dominican @ 35.010769
6 Brazilian @ 35.615810
7 Ashkenazy_Jew @ 41.478336
8 Albanian @ 41.765297
9 Greek_Thessaly @ 42.019688
10 Greek_Central @ 42.248173
11 Bulgarian @ 42.346031
12 Tuscan @ 42.570118
13 Montenegrin @ 42.647099
14 Macedonian @ 42.868404
15 Sicilian @ 42.999046
16 Bosnian @ 43.110920
17 Italian @ 43.130322
18 Romanian @ 43.137913
19 Sephardic_Jew @ 43.360863
20 Portuguese @ 45.019142

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Mexican +50% Colombian_B @ 9.159574


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Mexican +25% Ashkenazy_Jew +25% Maya @ 5.924855


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++




Just for kicks, the egyptian.
Here is PuntDNAL Africa8.
Admix Results (sorted):
# Population Percent
1 Western_Semitic 77.34
2 Omotic 7.98
3 Nilo_Saharan 5.87
4 W_Benue_Congo 5.05
5 Eastern_HG 1.42
6 E_Benue_Congo 1.34
7 Southern_HG 1.00


Finished reading population data. 48 populations found.
8 components mode.

--------------------------------
Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Algerian @ 5.286785
2 Mozabite @ 5.672263
3 Libyan @ 6.141260
4 Tunisian @ 6.471510
5 N_Moroccan @ 7.255887
6 Egyptian @ 11.618514
7 S_Moroccan @ 16.796829
8 Ethiopian_Tygray @ 31.563770
9 Ethiopian_Amhara @ 35.805096
10 Ethiopian_Afar @ 35.857704


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Algerian +50% Mozabite @ 4.754405


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Egyptian +25% Ethiopian_Tygray +25% Mozabite @ 3.264749


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++
1 Egyptian + Egyptian + Ethiopian_Tygray + Mozabite @ 3.264749
2 Egyptian + Egyptian + Ethiopian_Tygray + Tunisian @ 3.497202
3 Egyptian + Ethiopian_Tygray + Tunisian + Tunisian @ 3.644128
4 Egyptian + Ethiopian_Tygray + N_Moroccan + Tunisian @ 3.681411
5 Egyptian + Egyptian + Ethiopian_Tygray + N_Moroccan @ 3.727846

Based on my files, these appear to be segments of Ashkenazic origin. Your Ashkenazic portions of your DNA largely coincide with that of all other Ashkenazi Jews plus Italki Jews from Italy, Sephardic Jews from the Mediterranean region, Romaniote Jews from Greece, and Krymchak Jews from the Crimea to varying degrees. More details in my upcoming second book.

Gonna snip this from another thread. This is what helped me make progress, thank you once again for what you do. Ashkenazi Jewry lines up with bulgarian, greek was macedonian/romaniote on my grandfathers side, and Krymchak on my grandmothers side because of the Romanian+Tatar.


I'm triangulating the results with kits that match the desired jewish admixtures at a high enough decent snp, and I found a lot of these kits share DNA from Calabria and North Italy, like "Abruzzo" and "Friul", I know Jews have ancient italian genes that can "trip the circuit" so to speak,

If his last name "Navarro" is anything to go by there's a chance of him just being a partial Belmonte Jew or simply some Italkim who diaspora'd elsewhere, but I recall one of his family members having the surname "Pardo"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardo_(surname)
I'll look through Mexican birth certificates and see if there are more surnames like that. There have had to been more Greek families with that surname.

MDLP K16. This one has no Jordanian.
Just italian, which throws me off.
Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Amerindian 36.91
2 Caucasian 17.13
3 Neolithic 15.68
4 NorthEastEuropean 8.3
5 Steppe 7.06
6 NearEast 4.75
7 Subsaharian 4.35
8 SouthEastAsian 2
9 Arctic 1.81
10 NorthAfrican 1.47
11 Ancestor 0.53

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Athabask (NA) 29.5
2 Tlingit (NA) 34.21
3 Jew (Ashkenazi) 40.47
4 Swiss (Switzerland) 42.94
5 Lipka_Tatar (Belorus) 42.97
6 Gagauz (Gagauzia) 43.19
7 Romanian (Romania) 43.24
8 Italian (Friul) 43.25
9 Italian (NorthIitaly) 43.26
10 Jew (Belmonte) 43.28
11 Tatars (Tatarstan) 43.32
12 Austrian (Austria) 43.63
13 Portuguese (Portugal) 43.76
14 Romanian (Apuseni) 43.84
15 Moldavian (Molodva) 43.86
16 Corsican (Corsica) 44
17 Romanian (Gorj) 44.03
18 Jew (Ashkenazim) 44.07
19 Italian (Abruzzo) 44.1
20 Montenegrian (Montenegro) 44.1

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 58.7% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 41.3% Colla (NA) @ 5.01
2 60% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 40% Wichi (NA) @ 5.05
3 58.3% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 41.7% Cachi (NA) @ 5.06
4 57.6% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 42.4% Mayan (NA) @ 5.07
5 58.8% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 41.2% Pima (NA) @ 5.09
6 59.1% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 40.9% Zapotec (NA) @ 5.22
7 59.6% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 40.4% Bolivian (LaPaz) @ 5.26
8 60.9% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 39.1% Karitiana (NA) @ 5.27
9 59.2% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 40.8% Mixtec (NA) @ 5.34
10 60.6% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 39.4% Mixe (NA) @ 5.37
11 60.8% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 39.2% Piapoco (NA) @ 5.39
12 60.7% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 39.3% Surui (NA) @ 5.42
13 56.9% Italian (NorthIitaly) + 43.1% Quechua (NA) @ 5.52
14 60% Jew (Belmonte) + 40% Wichi (NA) @ 5.62
15 58.7% Jew (Belmonte) + 41.3% Colla (NA) @ 5.64
16 57.6% Jew (Belmonte) + 42.4% Mayan (NA) @ 5.71
17 58.3% Jew (Belmonte) + 41.7% Cachi (NA) @ 5.77
18 59.1% Jew (Belmonte) + 40.9% Zapotec (NA) @ 5.78
19 58.8% Italian (Friul) + 41.2% Colla (NA) @ 5.83
20 58.3% Italian (Friul) + 41.7% Cachi (NA) @ 5.84

I might as well share my family's kits if you're thinking on comparing them to full-blooded bulgarian jewish populations. I really want to see what you're able to find, if it's not too much trouble of course.

Mom's DNA Kit
#MS9806947
Grandmothers DNA kit
#PB5659626
Cousins DNA kit
#UY5456490
My DNA kit
#FX7304650

Would anyone have any confirmed Romaniote, Italkim or Belmonte jewish kits? I'd appreciate that. I found these that match more than 11 SNP's for most of my family and it's interesting looking at their own admixture. I have dozen more kits, but I'm really reaching for the most conclusive.

These kits are the current data I have.
CM2046507
[Cousin] Largest segment = 10.3 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 17.3cM (0.483 Pct)

HH1966981 (Greek + Cyprus)
[Cousin] Largest segment = 11.4 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 11.4cM (0.319 Pct)

RK4409436
[Cousin] Largest segment = 11 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 26.2cM (0.731 Pct) 3 Shared

M938335
[Me] Largest segment = 12.5 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 44.3cM (1.236 Pct)

HS5624042 [Anthony]
[Cousin] Largest Segment = 7.3 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 14.4cM

WL2542374
[Cousin] Largest segment = 11.9 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 19.2cM (0.535 Pct)

BB2326361
[Cousin] Largest segment = 11.4 cM
Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 11.4cM (0.318 Pct)

AL4343725
[Cousin] Largest segment = 8.3 cM
Total Half-Match segments 16cM

M367286 (Bulgarian)
[Me] Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 7.8cM (0.218 Pct)

AY8134147
11.9 Mom / 11.2 Cousin(*)

TU9083447 (Tuscan Turk Ashkenazi)
[Cousin] 17.2c snp, 10.1cm largest


I can only hazard a guess where they're from but they have some of our dna and that helps me explore the possibilities. I'm keeping my eyes out on trace amounts of Italian because that keeps showing up too.

Jews from Sicily, Venice, Calabria and other Italian cities migrated to Salonica and formed the synagogues Sicilia Yashan and Italia Yashan, so there might've been some Italkim, who knows.
https://www.primidi.com/history_of_the_ ... ganization
https://www.athensinsider.com/the-forgo ... ssaloniki/

There were also migrations from Calabria.
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/calabria

[Patrick Myers]

HI Mr. Kevin Brooks.

I have descent from Persian Jews /Sefardim that converted to Ashkanazim, and I do also have a great grandfather who was an Ashkanazim Rabbi of Sefardic descent. My grandmother converted to Chassidism. The great grandfather also converted to Chassidism. I am told that they were part of a Chassic dynasty.

I want to do some research on my DNA. I self identify and practice Judaism anyway. But I am interested.

My kit numbers are:

LK5118067 Elizabeth Catherine HerbertLE access disabledPencil Edit Kit ProfileGC8368617 Elizabeth Catherine Herbert

Elizabeth Catherine Herbert is my adopted legal name. I was born Elisabet Danielle DeSalvo Hernly Ichiju.

I have 20% Polish, about 9% Iberian, 14% Baltic, 8% native American, 2% Ashkanazim, and 30% Far East Asian Indian Islander (20% of this is Japanese). I also have UK/British Isles descent of about 20% ish. There is some overlap.

My grandmother (matriarchal) was a Persian/Sefardic Jew who converted to Chassidism. My maternal descent includes Ito, TeClaw (De Seville, De Silva, De Salvo, etc.) & Fruend. My grandmother's husband was the Archduke of Austria, and was a descent of Lafeyette, Seymour the Marquis of Hartford, & Mary Steward, as well as a Spencer. He was also a royal, a doctor of the Japanese royal descent, and his surnames included Abesawa, Ichiju, Nahama, Nguyene, Oana, Hernly)

My father's line is Stout and Perrigan. These I am told were Jewish people who converted to Lutheran for the sake of pursuing positions in Academia, but who secretly practiced. They also had Amish and royal descent.

I have been reading over the forums and comparing kits. I compared to A068680.

Largest segment = 8.4 cM

Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 46.4cM (1.295 Pct)
Estimated number of generations to MRCA = 5.8

6 shared segments found for this comparison.

154561 SNPs used for this comparison.

51.879 Pct SNPs are full identical

Comparison took 0.164.
CPU time used: 0.021.

Ver: Jan 16 2023 04 42 34

I also decided to compare with your kit number T544042 just out of curiosity, and this was the result.

Largest segment = 9.8 cM

Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 57cM (1.592 Pct)
Estimated number of generations to MRCA = 4.2

7 shared segments found for this comparison.

156267 SNPs used for this comparison.

51.721 Pct SNPs are full identical

Comparison took 0.169.
CPU time used: 0.021.

Ver: Jan 16 2023 04 42 34

May you please point me in the right direction as to the best kits to compare?

I have read some of your writings, and it is very interesting. Kind Regards,

Ms.Elizabeth Hernly

I am similar to you in a few ways lol. I am Afro-American I have been researching my lineage since I found out I had an uncommon haplogroup.
I have been seeing if I match any kits in this thread and I linked up with yours. The history you state is also interesting and goes with my own theory

Comparing Kit LK5118067 (Elisabet Hernley) [MyHeritage] and Kit FE7330101 (*BenKuzari) [Living DNA]

Segment threshold size will be adjusted dynamically with an average of 200 SNPs. About 2/3 will occur between 185 and 214 SNPs.
Minimum segment cM to be included in total = 7.0 cM
Mismatch-bunching Limit will be adjusted to 60 percent of the segment threshold size for any given segment

Largest segment = 10.4 cM

Total Half-Match segments (HIR) 10.4cM (0.291 Pct)
Estimated number of generations to MRCA = 5.2

1 shared segments found for this comparison.

323408 SNPs used for this comparison.

63.012 Pct SNPs are full identical

Comparison took 0.329.
CPU time used: 0.025.

[Elizabeth Catherine Herbert]

Greetings Patrick Myers,

How are you? I hope you are well.

I have about 2% African Descent and I also have ancient descent from the Moors. I am descended from the Potters through my birth father Robert Stout, and I also have African Descent through my grandfather Jacque Nguyen Henrley Ichiju, also known as Mohammad bin Heraldi Houssan in the Islamic World. He was originally Muslim, but converted to Judaism to marry my grandmother Merium Fruend Ito Cohen (a shorter version of her name) also known as Marianne and as Merium TeClaw (her first marriage, she was a widow when my grandfather married her).

My grandfather of blessed memory lived as Muslim and Jewish. He was also descended from Lafayette and Lafayette's Mulatto wife, whom he took to live in France to protect from racism.

My grandmother was originally born on an Island in Iran and was a Perian Jew/Sefardi Jew, whose father was an Ashkenazi Rabbi also of Sefardi descent.

I am also a Myers by descent.

Nice to meet you, cousin.

Thank you for your message. Kind Regards,

Elisabet

[montevago]

RIP Martin Davis. May his memory be blessed.